Grenadier Guards in Canada c. 1860?

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Re: Grenadier Guards in Canada c. 1860?

Postby rd72 » 14 Sep 2016 23:10

HI all,

Here are undoubtedly some of the fellow officers (and a CSgt) that your man served with.

http://www.musee-mccord.qc.ca/scripts/s ... rds&Lang=1

The humans, not the toys... :-)
Cheers,
Rob
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Re: Grenadier Guards in Canada c. 1860?

Postby BingandNelsonFan » 14 Sep 2016 23:31

jf42 wrote:Sarh, have you attempted contact with the Eliot family who are still at Port Eliot, St Germans? Not that it would necessarily be a straightforward process, their being one of the more unconventional branches of the aristocracy.


Thanks for the suggestion! Actually, yes, I have been in contact with them for five years. The late Lord St. Germans and I wrote quite often, and it was our wish together to make as much of the family info available to researchers as possible --- which is why I have digital images of all the albums, etc., to work on. However, a lot of the photos are unmarked or only partially marked. All of the pictures, though (once I've figured out the basics), will be available on my website here:
http://www.eliotsofporteliot.com/

The family has never retained an archivist of any kind, and their papers and documents had never been sorted. Most of those are now deposited at the Cornwall Record Office, but it's amazing how many things I've been able to uncover so far!
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Re: Grenadier Guards in Canada c. 1860?

Postby BingandNelsonFan » 14 Sep 2016 23:35

rd72 wrote:HI all,

Here are undoubtedly some of the fellow officers (and a CSgt) that your man served with.

http://www.musee-mccord.qc.ca/scripts/s ... rds&Lang=1

The humans, not the toys... :-)


Great link! You are totally correct. In fact, some of those men appear in the album that I'm working on. I've got my Mom helping me to make a spreadsheet document with all the names, and we did a lot today. The photos include a lot of Grenadier Guards, as well as some members of the Scots Fusilier Guards, Royal Engineers and Royal Artillery.
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Re: Grenadier Guards in Canada c. 1860?

Postby colsjt65 » 15 Sep 2016 01:24

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Re: Grenadier Guards in Canada c. 1860?

Postby Spañiard » 17 Sep 2016 01:41

BingandNelsonFan wrote:Hi! I have pictures of photos from an album full of identified photos of various members of the Grenadier Guards in Canada (c.1860). I'm working on getting all the photos online this Winter, but I was wondering if anyone would be able to help me with a little possible background to the album. One of the Gren. Guards is the Hon. Charles G.C. Eliot, and it is his album. Some photos show officers in uniform, some show them in cold-weather, snow clothes, some show them in fancy dress and costumes, and some of the wives are pictured. There are some scenery pictures as well, and some identified as Montreal. General Lindsay and his wife are shown in several photos, too.

What would a large group of Grenadier Guards have been doing in Canada? Does anyone know when they would have been stationed there?

Regards,
Sarah



Hi, First it was called Quebec, then Upper/lower Canada, then "United Province Canada" etc., by the Trent Affair. Guards Infantry 1st Regiment (Grenadier Guards), 1838-42: that's for Upper and Lower Canada Rebellion & 1862-63: for the Trent Affair at Province Quebec. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Province_of_Canada

I just checked never posted this ici (here), will have to post: The “Trent Affair,” Birth Of The United Canada’s Active Militia Battalions, 1861-62. http://wp.me/p55eja-3N

Many Historians etc state it was more saber rattling between Britannia, a her rebellious sibling, America.


Edwards's military catalogue. Books, pamphlets, plates, &c. on military history and biography, narratives of expeditions and campaigns, land battles & sea fights, sieges & blockades in all ages and countries, the art of war, army and navy administration, regimental records, costumes, badges, medals, &c
https://archive.org/details/edwardssmilitary00franrich

I believe have some stuff on them while in Quebec will check on a later date


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History is not like playing horseshoes where close enough counts; those that have done the proper leg work have a responsibility to insure a detailed accurate account. Canada at War Blog
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Re: Grenadier Guards in Canada c. 1860?

Postby Spañiard » 17 Sep 2016 14:52

BingandNelsonFan wrote:
rd72 wrote:HI all,

Here are undoubtedly some of the fellow officers (and a CSgt) that your man served with.

http://www.musee-mccord.qc.ca/scripts/s ... rds&Lang=1

The humans, not the toys... :-)


Great link! You are totally correct. In fact, some of those men appear in the album that I'm working on. I've got my Mom helping me to make a spreadsheet document with all the names, and we did a lot today. The photos include a lot of Grenadier Guards, as well as some members of the Scots Fusilier Guards, Royal Engineers and Royal Artillery.



I can assure McCord M might have more, a portion of their vast collection is not on-line.

checked for few hours on some sticks last night, have ca. 14 and found as fallows.


For 1862 British Regiments in Canada, and Officer Commanding: Stationed in Montreal 1st Battalion Grenadier Guards, Colonel Bruce commanding.

For 1863 Military Departments, for Major General & Staff--- Major General the Hon. J. Lindsay, commanding brigade of Guards, lower Canada District; Captain the Hon C. G. C. Eliot's, Grenadier Guards, Alde-de-Camp; Captain P. Smith, Grenadier Guards, Brigade Major.

Adjutant General's Department. Sergeant R. Malbon, Grenadier Guards, temporary clerk.

British Regiments in Canada, and Officer Commanding: HQ at Montreal, 1st Battalion Grenadier Guards, Colonel Wynyard commanding.

On Wednesday 6th September 1864 1st Battalion Grenadier Guards left Montreal.


C.U.
Last edited by Spañiard on 21 Sep 2016 01:45, edited 3 times in total.
History is not like playing horseshoes where close enough counts; those that have done the proper leg work have a responsibility to insure a detailed accurate account. Canada at War Blog
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Re: Grenadier Guards in Canada c. 1860?

Postby BingandNelsonFan » 17 Sep 2016 15:06

Thanks for the info! I believe that I have a photo of each gentleman you have listed. There are two albums filled with photos belonging to Captain C.G. Eliot dating from the 1850s-1864. One album is only photos from Canada in 1862-4. That's great to have the exact date that the 1st Batt. of Grenadier Guards left Canada.

Am working on getting the photos cataloged and sorted and onto a webpage. :)

If anyone thinks they could offer a clue for identification purposes on this fellow:
viewtopic.php?f=19&t=11467#p59276
Someone has written that this gentleman is an officer in the Coldstream Guards. The photographer began business at that address in 1879 (and on into the 20th Century), and it is likely that the photo dates around that time --- judging from the other photos in the album. My guess is that this will be a friend of Captain Eliot, perhaps dating from the early 1860s.

Sarah
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Re: Grenadier Guards in Canada c. 1860?

Postby Spañiard » 21 Sep 2016 01:39

BingandNelsonFan wrote:
Redleg56 wrote:Hi Sarah:

I have the Grenadiers leaving Canada in 1864. Maybe my information is incorrect, or some elements of the Regiment were still in Canada in 1865.

It may also be possible that Charles Eliot remained in Canada on detached service from his Regiment. Staff duties maybe?

Looking forward to the photos!

Mike


Absolutely right that he may just have remained in Canada. In fact, I'll do some research on that. Seeing these albums of his were the first realization that I had that he even served in the Grenadier Guards. He would go back to England and serve for decades as the personal equerry to Prince Christian of Schleswig Holstein. I'm not sure when Eliot quit the Grenadier Guards, so I'll see what I can find out . . . and that might make things a bit more clear. I'll be sure to post an update.

Sarah


Hi not quite, found old disc with a paper I assembled many moons ago, etc., only one man remained in Montreal went MIA, AWOL, :o It was mention in records:


DEPARTURE OF THE GUARDS: At about five o'clock the Grenadier Guards and a portion of the Fusilier Guards in garrison were marched on board the steamers Montreal and Napoleon. The Grenadiers were under command of Colonel De Horsey, and the detachment of the Fusiliers under command of Colonel Aitcheson. They were played down to the wharf by the band of the 30th Regiment, and as they were marching on board "Auld Langsyne" was played, awakening in those present genuine emotions of regret. A guard of the Fusiliers kept the ground, assisted by a fatigue party of the 63rd Regiment…..As she started the crowd gave the departing troops a hearty cheer ; and as the steamer left the basin, headed towards Quebec, officers and soldiers joined in three cheers for the Montrealers, which was again returned.

It is deserving of mention that of the whole Grenadier battalion only one man was missing when the corps was mustered for embarkation.

The Himalaya arrived on Sunday, September 18, at Spithead from Quebec with the 1st battalion, under the command of Lieutenant-Colonel W. de Horsey, Lieutenant-Colonels T. Bramston, E. Wynne, and W. Stucley; Captains Phillips, Bridges, Fairfax, Hope, Fox, Seymour, Clinton, Herbert, Legh, Stanley, Hon. C. Crichton, and Lautour ; Lieutenants Duncombo, Hon. E. Littleton, and H. Seymour ; Captain and Instructor of Musketry Buller; Captain and Adjutant Thynne ; Quartermaster Hockey ; Surgeon-Major C. R. Nicoll; Assistant-Surgeon Lawrence ; 720 non-commissioned officers and privates, 87 soldiers' wives, and 105 children. The battalion arrived in London on Monday evening, and went into quarters in Chelsea Barracks. On Tuesday the remaining five companies of tho 2nd battalion of the Grenadier Guards left London, vid the South-Eastern Railway, to Shorncliff Station, four companies having vacated Chelsea Barracks, and one company St. George's Barracks, to make room for the 1st battalion, which arrived from Canada on the previous day.


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Re: Grenadier Guards in Canada c. 1860?

Postby BingandNelsonFan » 21 Sep 2016 14:22

Thanks for that info. I've now been able to go through most of the album, and I think that the 1865 date on the photo is probably just a mistake.

There seem to be a number of photos showing different officers who were in the Snowshoes club, as they are posed in winter clothes with snowshoes. :)

The article transcriptions were most interesting. Thanks for posting!

Sarah
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Re: Grenadier Guards in Canada c. 1860?

Postby BingandNelsonFan » 14 Sep 2017 21:23

Finally, I have got the album posted that is filled with the photos of Guards in Canada from 1862-4. I've got basic captions/identification on each photo and plan to fill a bunch of them in and beef them out later. There is another album coming soon --- the back half of which are the matching photos (saved by the same officer) of the same gents in the 1860-1 period while younger and still in England.

Here's the link to the album:
http://eliotsofporteliot.com/albums/index.php?/category/3

Thanks to everyone for their help in explaining to me what this group was!
Regards,
Sarah
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